Stephen Smith, Minister For Defence, Transcript Of Press Conference,

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17th October 2010, 09:38pm - Views: 1022

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Stephen Smith, Minister for Defence, Transcript of Press Conference, 

Perth on Sunday, 17 October 2010


Can I firstly make some remarks about the Parliamentary debate on Afghanistan

this week, to outline some of the processes.  Firstly the debate will commence on Tuesday after

Question Time. After Question Time on Tuesday the Prime Minister will present a Prime Ministerial

statement on Afghanistan.

The Leader of the Opposition, in accordance with the usual House processes and practices will then

respond for the same amount of time as the Prime Minister's statement. I will then move a procedural

motion, which will enable the House to debate the Prime Minister's statement, and debate on that will

take place on the Wednesday and on the Thursday.

The procedural motion will envisage that a small number of office bearers, whether it's the Minister

for Defence, the Minister for Foreign Affairs, the Shadow Minister for Foreign Minister, a small

number of officeholders, to speak for 20 minutes in the course of that debate and all other members

who wish to speak to speak for the now usual period of 15 minutes.

And I will move that procedural motion at the conclusion of the Leader of the Opposition's response to

the Prime Minister. 

We expect that the debate will conclude on the Thursday and in the course of Wednesday or Thursday

there may be a period where it's appropriate to refer the debate to the Main Committee. That is a

matter for judgement next week.

My colleague, the Leader of the House, Mr Albanese has been in discussions and contact with

interested parties, in the course of coming to these proposed arrangements. Of course it will be open

for anyone in the House to move amendments to that procedural motion. But hopefully we think that

we've set the scene for a good debate on Afghanistan.

The Senate of course next week is dealing with Estimates. So it is proposed that the Senate conduct its

own debate on Afghanistan the following week, the second week of this current fortnight

Parliamentary sittings.

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Today I'm publicly releasing, to assist in that debate, a half a dozen fact sheets which detail Australia's

involvement in Afghanistan. These fact sheets are intended to be precisely that, they are fact sheets.

They have been prepared by the relevant departments;

by the Department of Defence, by the

Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, by the Australian Federal Police and by our development

assistance agency, Ausaid. 

Very much, if not all, of what you find in the fact sheets is already publicly available information.  But

we have brought it all together into a series of half a dozen fact sheets to provide effectively an aide

memoire for those people either taking part in the debate or who are observing the debate.

And those fact sheets range from the commitment of the International Security Assistance Force, the

history of Australia's military involvement in Afghanistan, and our current contribution in Uruzgan


whether that contribution is military or civilian, whether it's training or whether it is

development assistance. And some of the material is taken directly from International Security

Assistance Forces (ISAF) materials.

The material is not proposed to be argumentative. That will be a matter for the debate and I'm sure the

Prime Minister in her Ministerial Statement will set the scene for the rationale for Australia's

involvement in Afghanistan. 

As you know, the Government has continually made the point that we believe it is in our national

interest to be in Afghanistan. We believe that it's not just in Australia's national interest but also in the

international community's interest to be in Afghanistan, to help ensure that Afghanistan does not again

become a breeding ground for international terrorism.

We are there as part of the United Nations mandated International Security Assistance Force (ISAF)

and in Uruzgan we work very closely of course, not just with our ally the United States, but with a

number of other countries. 

Can I just make reference to the ASEAN Defence Ministers Plus meeting which took place in Hanoi

last week.

I spent Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday in Hanoi for the purposes of that meeting. That

was a very important meeting because for the first time we saw Defence Ministers meet in the context

of our region, the Asia Pacific, in the ASEAN Plus format, mirroring what we'll see in the near future

with an expanded East Asia summit including the United States and Russia.

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I make that point because in the course of that meeting I had a discussion with Defense Secretary

Gates, with the United States Defense Secretary Gates. We of course discussed Afghanistan. Secretary

Gates continues to be very complimentary of the effort that Australia makes and that our forces make.

In particular he is very complimentary of the efforts and the quality of the work done by our embedded

personnel. In the materials that have been distributed you'll find reference to the some 150 embedded

personnel in our Afghanistan effort.

But most importantly Secretary Gates made the point to me that he sees the NATO ISAF summit in

Lisbon in November this year as being a most important meeting, a most important summit for NATO,

for ISAF and for the international community.  Because he, as does the NATO Secretary General, sees

that summit as very much paving the way

for the detail of the transition to security authority and

security lead responsibility to the Afghanistan National forces.

As you know, our mission in Uruzgan is part of that overall transition effort to train the Afghan

National Army and the Afghan National Police, so that they are in a position to effect lead

responsibility for security matters. And the advice we continue to receive from the Chief of the

Defence Force is that we believe that we can effect that effort in Uruzgan in the next two to four years,

meeting the transition, timetable set by the international community and ISAF, at the Kabul

conference in Afghanistan itself in July August of this year.

Can I finally make some remarks, and then I'm happy to respond to your questions on these and other

matters, about the Director of Military Prosecutions and the charging by the Military Prosecutions of

three Australian defence personnel, arising from an incident in Afghanistan where we saw tragically a

number of civilians killed.  

I see Mr Abbott has again this morning made some remarks about that matter.  I think it is very, very

important in the area of military justice that we very calmly understand the independent process that is

in train and we very carefully understand the ramifications that this has for the three individuals

concerned.  But also the wider ramifications it has for the integrity of Australia's military justice


In this case, effectively the only substantive matter that has changed over the history of Australia's

military justice system has been the appointment of an independent Director of Military Prosecutions

who has made an independent judgement about whether or not defence personnel should be charged.

The establishment of the Director of Military Prosecutions was effected by legislation, introduced by

the Howard Government, of which Mr Abbott was a Cabinet member.

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It was supported by both of the major political parties in both the House and the Senate and indeed the

Shadow Minister for Defence, Senator Johnson, supported the legislation when it passed through the


So what is occurring is as a direct result of legislation enacted by the Howard Government, of which

Mr Abbott was a Cabinet member. And the Labor Party in Opposition and now continues to support

the notion of an independent Director of Military Prosecutions. That is a change from historically

when service Chiefs, or service officers, were involved in the determination as to whether charges

should be brought or not.

Mr Abbott has made remarks in the past about the capacity under the legislation, that was presented to

the Parliament by the Howard Government, for the service Chiefs, for the Chief of the Defence Force,

or his representative, to make representations or submissions to the military prosecutor, to the Director

of Military Prosecutions. 

It's very important to understand that those representations do not go to whether charges should be

preferred or not. They do not go to the guilt or the innocence of the three individuals concerned. It's

also very important to make the point that those representations are made by the Chief of the Defence

Force or his representative. They are not made by the Government of the day, and nor should they.

Just as it is appropriate to have an independent Director of Military Prosecutions to make these

judgements independent from the service Chiefs, so it would be inappropriate for the Government of

the day, the Minister of the day or anyone else, to be making representations to her about these

matters. And the legislation which Mr Abbott supported, the legislation which Senator Johnson

supported, only envisages that service Chiefs make representations about general defence


This is not the opportunity for mounting a defence in the case of the three personnel concerned. That

opportunity now arises and as the Chief of the Defence Force has made clear, as the Chief of Army

has made clear and as I have made clear and again make clear today, no resource will be spared. Every

effort will be affected to ensure that the three individuals concerned have whatever legal

representation they want to affect their legal defence. The Chief of Army has made that clear to the

individual families concerned.

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In addition to that other support and assistance will be provided to the families concerned. This is of

course a very difficult time for the three personnel concerned and a very difficult time for their

families, and we understand that.

It is also the case that the integrity of our military justice system is very important to us. We have a

well deserved and well earned international reputation for dealing with these matters in an objective

and a clear and a sensible way. Our Defence Force personnel also have a very well deserved reputation

for conducting themselves in accordance with the rules of law and conducting themselves in

accordance with the various Vienna and Geneva conventions.  That is an important aspect of both the

military and the peacekeeping contributions that we make.

So thanks for that and I'm happy to respond to your questions on the matters I've raised or other



Do you expect to have many Labor politicians to depart from the party line generally

late next week and how would that be greeted?


Well as the Prime Minister and I have made

clear, we welcome whatever

interventions Members of Parliament want to make. Of course the Government has a view about the

rationale for our involvement in Afghanistan. But as I've made clear, as the Prime Minister has made

clear, we regard it effectively as entirely a matter for individual Members of the Parliament concerned

to make their own contributions.

I believe that it's a very good thing that we're having the Parliamentary debate. I believe it will be both

informative and educative. Informative because I think there is an under-appreciation of precisely

what we're doing in Uruzgan province. Our mission is to train and mentor the Afghan National Army

and the Afghan National Police, to put them in a position to manage their own security affairs.

I also think there is an under-appreciation of the fact that we are not there by ourselves. We are there

as part of a 47 member International Security Assistance Force. Sometimes I think people either

assume we're there by ourselves or there only with the United States. We are there with a 47 member


So it'll be entirely a matter for Members, and subsequently Senators, to make their own contribution.

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Brigadier Mark Smethurst has said that reviewing the Government's priorities that the

Middle East is no longer a principal task and so therefore is it a priority of the Government to continue

our commitment in the region?


I haven't had the opportunity of reading the Smethurst paper but I think it's very

important to understand precisely what the Smethurst paper is and when it was written. Firstly it was

an academic contribution that he made as part of a Defence Force studies academic exercise.  So the

views are entirely his and it's entirely appropriate that Defence personnel engage in this academic

exchange. That's the first point. 

Secondly, his paper was penned in April and May of 2009. It does not take into account the materials

put into the public domain by the Riedel review. It does not take into account the materials put into the

domain by the McCrystal and subsequent Obama review. 

So we've seen as a result of the Riedel review, and as a result of the McCrystal review, a much


focussed approach to the International Security Assistance Force strategy in Afghanistan. The

Smethurst paper was a general paper, not about Australia's contribution but a general paper about a

counter insurgency strategy in Afghanistan. 

We've come a long way since he penned his paper and that has been as a direct result of a very clear

focus, in the first instance by Mr Riedel, secondly by General McCrystal and thirdly by President

Obama himself, with the decisions in December 2009 to focus much more squarely the mission on

training, and to focus the mission much more squarely on transition.  But at the same time to affect,

rule of thumb, a 40 per cent surge increase to enable security matters to be dealt with more effectively,

to provide the environment for that training and mentoring.


What about his point that the key reason we're there is primarily the alliance with the

United States? How does the Government feel about that?


The Government's response is the same as

our response since we came to

Office. We are there for a range of reasons. We have never hidden that. We are there because we are

very strongly of the view that we can't allow Afghanistan to become a breeding ground for

international terrorism again. We have been regrettably on the receiving end of such international

terrorist acts. But we're also there as part of a

United Nations mandated International Security

Assistance Force. That point is very important and often forgotten.

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There is a United Nations Security Council resolution which mandates the international effort,

including Australia's effort in Afghanistan. Indeed this was unanimously renewed by the Security

Council in the last few days.

Thirdly, of course we are there working very closely with our ally

the United States. We work very

closely with them. That is understandable, both generally in terms of Afghanistan but also in Uruzgan

province. In recent times, with the withdrawal of the Dutch, we've of course seen changed

arrangements in Uruzgan province with what we now describe as combined Team Uruzgan.  Which is

effectively led in partnership by the United States on the military side and by Australia on the civilian


So of course we work closely with our ally and indeed, as the fact sheets make clear, we have about

150 officers

and personnel embedded in the International Security Assistance Force headquarters. 

That has seen over a long period of time Australians come in very close contact with senior United

States military officers, including General Petraeus


including General McCrystal and including

General McKinnon before him. And that has held us in very good stead.

So I don't respond to that question in the simplistic way that some others do. We are there for a variety

of very important reasons but if you said please give me the reason, the only reason why we are there,

we are there because it is in our national interest to be there.


Have any Labor people indicated that they would depart from the party line during the

debate next week?


None of my colleagues have indicated that to me. But as I say I haven't been

searching the corridors trying to determine what people's contributions will be. That's entirely a matter

for them.


How much weight will the Greens have on future government policies in Afghanistan?


The Greens have a policy, which is entirely different from the Government's

and historically entirely different from the Liberal Party's. 

As I understand it, the Greens' policy approach is that we should withdraw our presence from

Afghanistan immediately. That is not our view. As I understand the Greens' position, their view is that

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we should never have committed troops or forces to the effort in Afghanistan. That is not the

Government's view. 

So the Greens have an entirely different approach to this matter, that's known and understood. But it

does not get in the way of the Government's very strong view that it's in our national interest to be in

Afghanistan. It's in our national interest to make an appropriate contribution which is what we are



With regard to the proposal to accommodate asylum seekers within the community,

does the Government anticipate that that will result in any kind of squeeze on the rental market or will

these people be accommodated in public housing? How is it going to work?


Firstly I think you should wait until Minister Bowen, the Minister for


makes comments about these matters. I'm happy to make some general remarks and

those general remarks are of course this Government has made it very clear when we came to office,

that we do not want to see children detained behind barbed wire or detained in high security


When he became Immigration Minister recently Minister Bowen made two things very clear. One was

that he wanted to, as soon as he could, get a handle on the long term accommodation needs, which he's

made clear that he's doing but secondly that he was from a personal and Ministerial point of view very

concerned about accommodation arrangements for children and also for vulnerable families.

I think we should not assume things and wait until Minister Bowen is in a position to make remarks

about these matters.


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